Friends and Enemies of Metalcore

Why is this genre a hated genre?

For those of you who are as into music as I am, you should know that public media loves to take a spin on a subculture and slap a name on it to market it. All genres have fallen victim to this (Punk, Metal, Hardcore and all its of its prefixes...Metalcore, Grindcore, Mathcore, and even its whiny more popular younger siblings emo and screamo). Metalcore bands that are a "hit" today, were "Metalcore" before it was the next big thing in the underground. Bands such as Poison The Well, Eighteen Visions, Most Precious Blood and its earlier incarnation, Indecision come to mind not to mention others. They have been in existence since about 1997. There is a problem here and that is trying to stick an image with a genre. The idea of metalcore for the uneduated musical masses have been painted due to certain bands popularity such as Atreyu and Bleeding Through. All black down to the clothes they wear, the color of their hair, and even the eyeliner. To me this is what makes the genre look bad. The mall image. Things that are sold in Hot Topic to sell a music genre in form of a clothing style. Now one may ask, what about Eighteen Visions? Don't they do the same thing as the two aformentioned bands? Well the answer is a little difficult to come up with. If we can look atthe history of this band lets recall what lead vocalist James Hart did for a living. He was a hair stylist. So this is understandable as to why he looks like he stepped out of a hair salon all of the time. The man knows his hair. Keep in mind, the band doesnt always dress up. There have been performaces that I have caught where it looked as if the band just stepped out of their bus unshowered and not really taking an interest in how they looked. They just looked like twenty somethings wearing whatever. This is my defense of Eighteen Visions. But I digress from my point, these bands did not choose to be called metalcore. In fact, if you asked them, the would simply say that they are a hardcore band. It seems as if metal purists think they are trying to snake their way into their holier than thou genre. Don't flatter yourslef guys, they best described their music as hardcore and the hardcore underground embraced it. Blame that on record labels. Back to my Eighteen Visions example, the fashioncore labeling is a disgrace to music. The origins of fashioncore are simple. Since Eighteen Visions enjoyed dressing up for their shows, the merch guys as a joke put "fashioncore" on the back of one of their t-shrits for sale. Well, the prhase caught popularity and then became a way to describe a band on how they dress. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, wether it is pro or anti metalcore but take into effect of the wide range musicianship that is there. Metalcore guitarists can play with the technicality of metal guitarists and with the breakdowns, the simplicity of a hardcore punk song. It is a solid musical genre but unfortunately the bands that existed before the turn of the millenium, are the better ones of the genre. What I really hope to accomplish is to find out why the genre is hated from the standpoint of a metal purist.


As a metal purist, I'd have to say its because Metalcore has people thinking its Metal when its barely similar to Alternative Metal, let alone True Metal. When I say True Metal I mean NWOHBM, Speed Metal, Thrash Metal, Death Metal, Black Metal, Power Metal, etc. Its just so far removed from what Metal is all about yet it claims to be Metal. Not the bands necessarily, though I bet some do, but the media definitely does. I'm angry enough that nu-metal or post-grunge bands are labeled Metal. I personally am not fond of the genre, its far too simplistic for me. To me, it seems they took the poor vocals of Hardcore and the midtempo of Heavy Metal and made a genre that is just too lazy to be either. Its sort of the opposite of Thrash Metal, which to me took the speed and lyrical ideologues of hardcore and melded them into a new Metal form back in the early 80's. Metalcore is closer to Nirvana than Slayer or Black Flag. Oh, and the whole mallcore thing is just sad, stepping away from the music a bit. Besides some factions in Black Metal, Metal is all about a simple style of dress, one which is pretty much impossible to commercialize. My friend just reminded me of another issue. The more Metalcore and other psuedo-Metal bands which spring up means yet another True Metal band that isn't. Metalcore should be the Metal audience, but isn't for reasons I don't get. marnues 06:20, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

What makes Death Metal anymore metal than the stuff that came via Agnostic Front as both scenes brought something new to the table? If metal had stayed static at MWOBHM (itself different to Black Sabbath) then we would have a dead musical genre. Pantera obviously had hardcore influences (from Phil) and nobody would deny that they are metal. You also forget that bands such as Motley Crue were considered metal in the 80's but now are considered rock because Metal got heavier. Bands like Anthrax and Slayer both have early hardcore influences and nobody in their right mind would question whether they were metal. Ultimately the name means that it is crossover music, but its actually closer to metal since AF went in a metal direction as the riffs got heavier and they lost the rawness. And how exactly is Killswitch Engage like Nirvana? Paul Tew 12:00, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
"As a metal purist, I'd have to say its because Metalcore has people thinking its Metal when its barely similar to Alternative Metal, let alone True Metal." I disagree in terms of sound a lot of metalcore in riffing style has more in common with Melodic Death bands such as At the Gates especially their Slaughter of the Soul album and many of my favorite metalcore bands appeal to me for the same reason's At the Gates does. I agree the scene kids ruin it for everybody and give a bad image of the average fan, and i agree metal and music in general shouldn't be about the fashion but i believe media and jaded metal fans have skewed your idea of true metal and when modern metalcore is no longer a fashion genre the good bands will rise to the top while those fashion bands will disappear and i believe it will be held in as high esteem as cross-over or melodic death metal within the pure metal scene. A good example is Darkest Hour's lastest album sounding unique but stylistically alot like At the Gates with its raw production, riffing style and vocal stylings. Also Darkest Hour have lost almost all their hardcore influence other than fanbase and attitude.

Many metal purists become very upset at the idea of overt commercialization of their music, and while I might agree not all metalcore bands are commercial (necessarily) or fashion-based, I find myself hard pressed to find bands that aren't. And metal purists are always, always, anti-MTV to some extent (myself included). Most metalheads I hear from seem to see it as that the "hardcore" bands have a far stronger punk influence than a metal influence. I will say for the record, being a purist, seeing the scene kids at school absolutely pisses me off (I'm down in Georgia, the only metal the average guy can find is whats on MTV, and I think there's only one other guy who's even heard of venom. Hope to get down to Florida, all the bands down here SUCK!:().Having everyone think of that as metal, and knowing that very few of the kids that listen to it will find Atheist, Death, or Necrophagist through it is sad. Though, perhaps we owe it something, as we can distinguish posers from the true(IMHO) bands, and keep our music to ourselves. And imagine what great metal all that hatred will produce! Anyway, wanted to shed some light on the subject, nobody take offense to my statements, please. 72.195.182.192 02:09, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Atreyu is a huge maybe for me

One more note, there is a bit of mention of Punk in all this talk. My take on it is that we are now (being IN metalcore) twice removed from Punk. Punk kindof spawned Hardcore, and thats a big Kindof (idealogically they are pretty different at their roots, nevertheless there is a lot of punk influence in hardcore, the big transition coming with bands like Bad Brains and Minor Threat). Hardcore spawned the "Core" in "metalcore" and Metal is obviously responsible for the "metal". Metal as a genre is so removed from Punk as far as roots go, that to call "Metalcore" a subgenre of either Metal, Hardcore, or Punk, isn't fully true. It's a blending of two very different styles (that sound the same to your parents), Metal and Hardcore. Now I'm done.

Hardcore isn't spawned from punk. Hardcore IS punk. All hardcore=punk. I don't know how many times I have to go through this with people. It is really quite annoying trying to explain to people that there is no such thing as a hardcore band that doesn't at least have an implied 'punk' after the term hardcore; ---> hardcore (punk). Granted New York styled hardcore bands are further removed from their punk roots than west coast hardcore bands, but they still have anti-authority lyrics and simplistic song structures (thus punk). I think the big misconception is derived from people calling early metalcore and bands like hatebreed hardcore. It created a rather nasty confusion.

Also, if my parents ever mistake Rise Against or Black Flag for metal, I'll kill them.

And Atreyu is not a metalcore band. At best Atreyu is an emocore band or just an emo band with metal influence.

Metalcore bands

-A life Once Lost (????),
-Age of Ruin,
-As I lay Dying,
-As Hope Dies,
-Avenged Sevenfold,
-Buried Inside,
-Coalesce (??),
-Converge,
-Hamartia (listen to them, you'll see),
-If hope dies,
-It Dies Today,
-Into the Moat (elements of metalcore + spazzcore, noisier than most, still not
noisecore),
-Killswitch Engage(?),
-Misery Signals,
-Saving Throw,
-Shai Hulud,
-The Red Chord (?),
-This Day forward (?),
-Unearth,
-Zao (??),
-Zombie Apocolypse,

Mathcore

One other thing - Mathcore is its own thing, maybe its a metalcore subgenre, maybe, but its different, but to mention that it is also called "noisecore" is terrible. (noiscore is a fine genre, hear me out) The names of the two genres imply that they are essentially polar opposites. Math Metal, and therefore Mathcore are "mathy", they are really technical and there is little or no "noise". Noisecore is noisy, its a term that is commonly missused by someone whos ear is not attuned to what they are listening to. Noisecore bands (from what I know) are not taht common and really just sound liek noise with some screaming overtop. There is no metal and barely any hardcore involved, I think its just kinda an indierock subgenre that often borders on electronic music. The closest thing to a metalcore/noisecore crossover is ( I think) The Locust. Some will disagree, thats fine, I dont even like the Locust.

That said here is a working list, add subtract, justify, most importantly, JUSTIFY. don't just delete a band and add the Blood Brothers cause you think it should be that way. Lets all try to do this with an open mind and remember that this genre is fairly obscure in the grand scheme of things and our definitions are going to be different based on geographical differences more than anything else. So I grew up outside Philly and now live in Upstate NY, this is how I see it

Moshcore

Really, I dont think thats metalcore, its obviously an influence, especially on the Core part, but I'd never call it metalcore, it should have its own page I think. -Shai Hulud... Doesn't appear on this page, which is funny because they are one of the only bands I have ever seen advertise themselves as Metalcore. They have very strong influences in both Metal and Hardcore and while their sound isnt typical metalcore (to me that means unearth ala oncoming storm or darkest hour circa so sedated) they are a very good example of metalcore. - Style... Little is said about the musical stylings of metalcore and things that are specific to it as a genre, Drop C tuning (or Drop D), Doublebass (drums), the intricacy in guitar riffs that is typical to Metal (Opeth, Emperor) with the brutal vocals that resemble Hardcore (Throwdown, Blood for Blood), Drums that stray between the two, sometimes straightforward and fast, half-time moshes, importance of time signature (im not a drummer, so im a little lost in that dept.) Anyway, this article is historically weak, which is understandable, because everyone has different ideas about how we got where we are and where that even is, but the music is there in front of us, so describe it right? If the problem is agreeing on bands that fall into the genre "Metalcore" then lets start with a general list. I don't proclaim to be an expert on this, but I will end this post with what I believe to be a basic list of current and recent Metalcore bands, people should add or subtract as they see fit, we may find this impossible to do, but if we can get a working lst of metalcore bands, perhaps we can get this ball rolling a little better

Gorgoroth is Metalcore?

Gorgoroth is a Black metal band. There's no "melodic" or "symphonic", they're just Black metal, and that's not even an opinion. Whoever said that they were using Metalcore influences obviously hasn't given them a listen. Even their newest album, Ad Majoram Sathanas Gloriam (newer albums usually condone 'softer' musical influences), is black metal. I removed that entire section. I have no evidence on "melodic metalcore", but I have a feeling that's a load of crap too. Mister Deranged 23:46, 1 September 2007 (UTC)